Any Ideas On What This May Be?
- Thread starter angellionel
- Start date
grinsebring
New member
Angel, It appears to be a date palm. How it got to your digging grounds in Ma. would be an interesting story. It is not a noble metal is it? Can you do anything with the writing on the obverse. It more than likely originated from the middle east.....Gil
OkieDigger
New member
Gill is right. It appears to be an ancient date palm coin. Roman coinage from Judea often depicts date palms (as I'm sure other areas in the middle east did). That's not to say this is Roman, but those would be the most common to be found. Try to identify the writing on the coin and that should tell you for sure.
Great info guys! thumbsup01
Thanks Gil! It isn't silver, but I remember it being heavy for its size. I have to look for it - I tossed it somewhere in one of the 'will get to later' piles.
Don't say it Angie! lol
Here is a closer look of the lettering, Gil.
I thought it looked Middle Eastern, but gave it no further thought than that when I first found it. The park is an old one, and it's located in a multi-cultural neighborhood. Thanks Dale!
That looks so very similar to the design on the one I have. So I may have found my oldest coin and didn't even know it?
Thanks Jimmy! Awesome stuff. thumbsup01
Thanks Gil! It isn't silver, but I remember it being heavy for its size. I have to look for it - I tossed it somewhere in one of the 'will get to later' piles.
Don't say it Angie! lol
Here is a closer look of the lettering, Gil.
I thought it looked Middle Eastern, but gave it no further thought than that when I first found it. The park is an old one, and it's located in a multi-cultural neighborhood. Thanks Dale!
That looks so very similar to the design on the one I have. So I may have found my oldest coin and didn't even know it?
Thanks Jimmy! Awesome stuff. thumbsup01
grinsebring
New member
The reverse shows an open pod, the pod shell split to the outside and the fruit hanging in the cluster like grapes. Good luck with this one Gil
Great info guys! thumbsup01
Thanks Gil! It isn't silver, but I remember it being heavy for its size. I have to look for it - I tossed it somewhere in one of the 'will get to later' piles.
Don't say it Angie! lol
See? Do you see why I say these things?!? God only knows what else of value is in that pile! :shocked04:
That is a fantastic find!
It was at about four to five inches. I found it at an area of the park where the grass had been stripped and soil had been eroded away due to constant foot traffic.
It could be a copy, though the apparent oxidation at the edges of the coin would seem to indicate some age. But I don't know for sure.
I never really took a close look at it. It's still a cool find either way. I had included it in my post from that day's hunt. Here you can get an idea as to size.
That's my professional opinion as well. lol
See? Do you see why I say these things?!? God only knows what else of value is in that pile! :shocked04:
That is a fantastic find!
I know. :huh: I'm not going to hear the end of it, am I. lol
Islandhunter
New member
I'll agree with it being Middle Eastern, my first thought when I saw it was that is was Jordanian...but have no clue as to which country it is from.... :-\
Neil in West Jersey
New member
This is definitely an interesting find.
One thing is for sure: The writing is Hebrew, no doubt about that. But it appears to be formal hebrew, which is something I have not seen on ancient coins. This would incline me to lean toward a modern souvenir coin.
I have forwarded a picture of your coin to an expert in ancient Jewish coins.
UPDATE: I already heard back from Bill Rosenblum of William M. Rosenblum, LLC, an expert in rare and ancient coins, and he confirmed what I thought. Here what he said:
Neil
You are correct this is not an ancient coin but a fantasy taken from a small bronze coin of the Bar Kochba revolt 132-135 CE. As you noticed it uses modern Hebrew to read Jerusalem on the palm tree side and For the Freedom of Jerusalem on the sides with the grapes. It should have ancient Hebrew instead.
Your find has probably been lying in the dirt/mud for quite awhile and has become somewhat corroded as these are usually fairly well manufactured and fairly modern. I would think they were made no earlier than the late 1960's.
I get inquires about this and a similar coin 20 or 30 times per year. It has no collector value as a coin and selling it as a coin is probably illegal. But if cleaned up it would look nice in a bezel.
Happy Hanukkah
Bill
Here is a little background on the symbols:
The palm tree and the palm branch figured frequently on Jewish coins. Palms symbolized water, around which they grew. From biblical times, palms had symbolized fertility, and height, as well. Palms were a symbol of Judea because they grew plentifully there. This meaning expanded, with the palm becoming a symbol for all of Palestine, and later, Israel. The Romans were apparently familiar with the meaning this symbol had for the Jews. After the First Revolt of the Jews was suppressed in 70 CE, the Roman emperor Vespasian minted a coin celebrating the nation's subjugation with the image of a palm tree flanked by a bound Jew and mourning Jewish woman. The coin's inscription read Judea Capta.
Clusters of grapes appeared on the coins of the Second Revolt, and grape leaves adorned the coins of both the First and Second Revolts. Grapes symbolized wine, an important product of Judea and Palestine. In the books of the prophets, the grape vine served as a symbol of Israel. It was also a symbol of blessing and fertility — Israel will grow as the vine (Hosea 14:8); Thy wife shall be as a fruitful vine (Psalm 128:3). Later, in the Talmud, the symbol grew grander: the vine was the world, Jerusalem, and the Torah, while the grapes symbolized the Patriarchs, the Sanhedrin and the scholars. Grapes were said to decorate the Temple's ritual vessels, and golden vines guarded the entrance to the sanctuary.
One thing is for sure: The writing is Hebrew, no doubt about that. But it appears to be formal hebrew, which is something I have not seen on ancient coins. This would incline me to lean toward a modern souvenir coin.
I have forwarded a picture of your coin to an expert in ancient Jewish coins.
UPDATE: I already heard back from Bill Rosenblum of William M. Rosenblum, LLC, an expert in rare and ancient coins, and he confirmed what I thought. Here what he said:
Neil
You are correct this is not an ancient coin but a fantasy taken from a small bronze coin of the Bar Kochba revolt 132-135 CE. As you noticed it uses modern Hebrew to read Jerusalem on the palm tree side and For the Freedom of Jerusalem on the sides with the grapes. It should have ancient Hebrew instead.
Your find has probably been lying in the dirt/mud for quite awhile and has become somewhat corroded as these are usually fairly well manufactured and fairly modern. I would think they were made no earlier than the late 1960's.
I get inquires about this and a similar coin 20 or 30 times per year. It has no collector value as a coin and selling it as a coin is probably illegal. But if cleaned up it would look nice in a bezel.
Happy Hanukkah
Bill
Here is a little background on the symbols:
The palm tree and the palm branch figured frequently on Jewish coins. Palms symbolized water, around which they grew. From biblical times, palms had symbolized fertility, and height, as well. Palms were a symbol of Judea because they grew plentifully there. This meaning expanded, with the palm becoming a symbol for all of Palestine, and later, Israel. The Romans were apparently familiar with the meaning this symbol had for the Jews. After the First Revolt of the Jews was suppressed in 70 CE, the Roman emperor Vespasian minted a coin celebrating the nation's subjugation with the image of a palm tree flanked by a bound Jew and mourning Jewish woman. The coin's inscription read Judea Capta.
Clusters of grapes appeared on the coins of the Second Revolt, and grape leaves adorned the coins of both the First and Second Revolts. Grapes symbolized wine, an important product of Judea and Palestine. In the books of the prophets, the grape vine served as a symbol of Israel. It was also a symbol of blessing and fertility — Israel will grow as the vine (Hosea 14:8); Thy wife shall be as a fruitful vine (Psalm 128:3). Later, in the Talmud, the symbol grew grander: the vine was the world, Jerusalem, and the Torah, while the grapes symbolized the Patriarchs, the Sanhedrin and the scholars. Grapes were said to decorate the Temple's ritual vessels, and golden vines guarded the entrance to the sanctuary.
Great info Neil! Thanks! You have a very good resource there. thumbsup01
At least now I don't have to worry about a certain friend bopping me on the head over this one. :bop: lol
At least now I don't have to worry about a certain friend bopping me on the head over this one. :bop: lol
woodwizard
New member
just for future reference-I believe it www .coincommunity.com . there is lots of good info to be had there